Heroes of the Storm

New Orphea talents: where’s the value?

HeroesoftheStorm 3 - New Orphea talents: where's the value?

Tldr: Orphea didn't need damage and healing nerfed.

Testing the new Orphea after this week's patch has given me a big losing streak.

  • The main patch changes were removing +1 chaos from Ancestral Strength, but adding a slow debuff on chaos basic attacks. The Fright talent for E wave slow was removed, and replaced with Chaotic Assault for bonus damage at 3 chaos.
  • Ancestral Strength and Fright were by-far the most common talents at 1 and 4. Q build wasn't changed, but Q build was already less popular so that's not this topic.
  • By "value" I mean adding damage and healing numbers together. Orphea usually wants both, so it's fair to treat them interchangeably. (Or, it could be claimed that Orphea's squishy body makes healing more important than damage)
  • How much was Ancestral Strength value nerfed? Untalented a Q+attack is 310 damage + 138 healing = 448 value. With the old Ancestral talent it's 390d + 184h = 574 (264 over untalented) . The new talent produces 344d + 138h = 482 (172 over) . So the new talent adds 65% as much damage value as the old one. (That's talking about Q, which is the spell Orphea can use the most frequently)
  • But new Ancestral Strength has a slow debuff. Is that worth reduced damage and no healing? I think not, because the slow is meaningless if the enemy is under any other CC. In theory you can Q+attack Q+attack in an endless loop to keep one enemy perma-slow… But that just means Orphea is acting like a Raynor-clone that's harder to play and can't fight non-heroes. (Also a problem for Q-build Nova)
  • The old Fright talent made it easier to hit E burst, because the E wave slowed a hero so he couldn't escape the burst. That interaction is gone. (And the E range is so long you can't usually apply slow with a basic attack)
  • The old Fright made it easier to hit Q on 2 heroes, because the E wave could slow both so they can't dodge. In general, having a slow on E wave was important because E wave is Orphea's only spell that is too fast to easily sidestep.
  • The new Chaotic Assault and Ancestral Strength talents have a usage conflict. To trigger Ancestral's slow you want to attack whenever you have 1 chaos, but Chaotic Assault needs to wait for 3 chaos.
  • How much value does Chaotic Assault really add? An untalented 3 chaos attack is 230 damage + 230 healing = 460 value. The talent makes that 552 value, or 20% more. But traditionally, Orphea wants to attack after each spell hit, without waiting for full chaos. Adding up 3 basic attacks with 1 chaos each is 828 value, or 50% more than using the talent. Of course there will be times you reach 3 chaos without time to attack in between, and then the talent is pure upside. But it's usually a mistake to try intentionally using the talent.
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