CloudTemplar's thoughts on Quarterfinals result joined by Pony.
Cloudtemplar- LCK caster, ex-pro player of Azu Frost
Pony- LPL Korean broadcast caster
Fnatic vs TES next
Why G2 is Good Against LCK but not LPL
Before we start let's start with something a bit light-hearted. A lot of people are asking why G2 are good against LCK but weak against LPL. It's because LPL is the better region so of course, G2 will do worse against LPL. That's why G2 do better against LCK than LPLfor now.
So I was watching this at home with my wife and GenG did worse than I expected… There was some misplays, some lackluster pick/ban, and I think there was a lot of mistakes in their preparation for the series. Also, G2 is pretty strong. -CT
So I predicted GenG to lose so I wasn't really surprised but what surprised me is that… I didn't expect them to lose this hard. I knew there are some mid lane difference and also skirmish difference but I didn't expect it to be this big… -Pony
Yeah, we don't really feel angry but more like saddened. There wasn't anything to be mad about it. GenG losing wasn't unexpected. We already knew it was coming but seeing them lose this hard was pretty sad for me. -CT
I think instead of what GenG picked it is much more what they gave to G2. G2 was able to get the comp they wanted for their playstyle. TF, Camille… let's say that Panth and Jhin weren't the top choices but just TF and Camille those two picks really enabled G2's playstyle. G2 really likes these kinds of champions, last time(last year) they played Camille and Ryze. They really like pick that accelerate the speed of the game and doing map plays. -Pony
So before this Worlds I have a couple of champion picks that I wanted to see(it was Shen and TF) and also some picks that won games but I was a bit unsure of. Azir is one of them. I couldn't say anything because Azir keeps winning. Actually nvm even when it won I still talked negatively about it. -CT
When you hear Azir you see BDD and when you hear BDD you see Azir. I admit BDD is really good on the champion but just because you are good at the champion doesn't mean the pick is good. But just like what Pony said instead of how bad the Azir is the problem is what they gave to G2. -CT
So if you look at GenG's comp it is all about team fight. Kalista, Taric, Azir, Lillia, Voilbear this comp is drafted for a 5v5 team fight. But how are you going to start a team fight against this G2 comp? -CT
This is a classic comp. Azir and Kalista gets lane priority and objective control which eventually forces enemy to have team fight for the objective. -CT
So I thought maybe they could take TF away at least but then in the after match conference they mentioned they practiced hard against TF so it was meant to be a bait.
One Good Thing GenG Did
So GenG's comp is all about teamfight and objective control. And in order to do that you need lane priority which GenG was able to do. Top was 6 to 4, Azir was able to push TF to his tower it was impossible for TF to move outside of his tower. So this is one thing GenG did good this series.
The Importance of GenG Bot lane
So for people wondering why TF is a good pick especially for G2. GenG through many iterations became a team that is reliant on its botlane. Top lane is strong but it is kind of hard to put a carry at top. In another word GenG is all about bot lane. You can either put all pressure on bot or let bot do their thing and in either case they will carry the team. But Kalista/Taric isn't a bot lane duo that can break the lane definitely. So I wonder what would happen if they just go all in on bot lane? -CT
To put it more bluntly that was really their best choice since their mid and jungle wasn't on form. I mean what can you do if they weren't on form? You should just accept it and draft around it. -CT
One thing that made Kalista very difficult to play in this match is Camille. You can't play forward against Camille so Ruler had to play back. -Pony
To be honest this game started well for GenG. GenG's bot lane was able to get lane priority, mid also did well against TF but once G2 was able to do their thing they couldn't keep up.-Pony
And to be honest how they can keep up against G2's comp with their comp? They can't match TF and Camille's speed. -CT, Pony
Also there were multiple times where they got caught offguard with information. Like when they saw TF move out or when they see Lillia doing red but despite all these information they wasn't able to evade it.
I TOLD YOU GUYS NEED TO WATCH OUT FOR SHEN. I TOLD YOU GUYS. -CT
A lot people are asking why more people didn't play Shen. Shen is actually a very difficult champion to play. There is only a few that could play it at the highest level. Shen player's mechanic isn't important. For for players that are bad at the champion they will be bad at the champion their entire career. Shen is only for a certain type of players. You have to have a high IQ and it is a champion that are reliant on your brain XD(edit: It is meant as a joke as Shen is CT's most played champion in SoloQ). -CT
Shen is an interesting champion. People either think he is useless or think he is a god. People were asking why they didn't ban Shen when Camille couldn't do much against Shen and that Shen counter TF and leona. It is surprising that a lot of people were saying this. -CT
First of all I think Shen Camille matchup is even. It is true that Camille lose against Shen early on but later the games go Camille win against Shen. The matchup is doable. If shen's laning phase is truly that godlike then people would've first picked him. People really exaggerate a lot the matchup isn't that bad for Shen or Camille.
TF vs Sylas
So Sylas isn't as a hard counter to TF as many people think. It is a old matchup that many people already know how to play both side of the matchup. Sylas is a difficult champion so sometime even when you are fed you can't do anything. -Pony
To be honest I don't think GenG went boom because of Shen or Sylas but because of Tahm Kench. For Tahm Kench I think they thought that if Ashe/Leona was able to get lane priority then Tahm Kench won't be much of a threat. Or at least I think that's what they were thinking when they gave Tahm Kench away since they did think about picking it. -Pony
So if you look at lane separately it was doable but then you realize they got Shen, Tahm,and Sylas which together wasn't doable. -Pony
So Leona wasn't really able to do anything against G2. Thankfully they were still able to win bot which again shows that maybe they should have went all in on Ruler. -CT
So what ended up happening is that G2 was able to counter GenG's win condition all the while fulfilling their own win condition. This is where GenG had to step up in terms of ingame plays. This isn't a pick/ban that aren't winnable with good plays.
So we have been talking Jankos' form. He hasn't been very impressive and his champion pool seems be very limited. We actually were saying he is becoming more like Cloudtemplar(lol). Jankos actually did a couple misplays in this game but even with that GenG made even bigger misplay afterward. Because GenG made so many mistakes
Yeah, I argree and to be honest I don't think either Junglers did well this series. It is like when Cloudtemplar was on Elise(his Elise was terrible despite good record). I didn't want to play Elise but because of the meta I had to play regardless what I wanted. Jankos is in a similar situation. Whether he likes or not he had to play these kind of champion. -CT
So we have been talking about numerous details about the game but if I were to sumarize the series it would be simply: Caps is insane. -CT
We can talk about rotation, pick/ban, and etc. but you can also just say Caps.
We talked about this last week we said that there will be a mid difference and GenG wasn't able to overcome that. Even botlane wasn't really able to break bot. Of course it is easy for us to say but in reality it's hard to break a lane in professional play. -CT
It is not the time to talk about this. G2 winning isn't something surprising, it's expected. If Damwon lost then we can have this conversation but right now we have to wait. Every region only have one team left except LPL so having only one team left isn't that strange. Stop saying things like "LCK couldn't keep up". It's way too early to say that.
Tahm Kench/Ezreal is probably the most LCK-like champions pick. I wonder if that's why they picked it. Korea is really a Ezreal/Tahm Kench region. This is something LCK are really good at. So maybe that's why they picked it going back to what they are really good at. -CT
This comp is really all about Ruler. Ruler is most confident in Ezreal and the whole comp is basically "trust Ruler". But if they were going to go that direction instead of Volibear something like Shen might be better or even someone with carry potential like Gankplank.
Rascal are an expert on Volibear vs Renetkon matchup so he might have been confident in this matchup but he wasn't able to keep up with Renetkon's split push. The reason why I think other pick is better is because they are Ren/Graves. Because they are full AD it is easy to itemize against it so you don't have to pick counter like Volibear. The forementioned picks could work. Gankplank also work as a second threat. Maybe it is because I saw too many Biin's Gankplank but he could serious pose as a second threat.
But then we have Sylas which you don't want to pick Shen or Gankplank into. The thing about pick/ban is that it is like a circle. You can't win everything.
"If they went A then you should have went B -> If You went B then they would have went C -> If they went C then you should have went A-> If You went A then they would have went B -> etc."
Ornn Ban Why?
Look at Rascal's champion pool. The picks good against Ornn are Vladimir, Gankplank which Rascal are a bit… unfamiliar with let's put it like that. I think they banned Ornn because they don't have an answer against it. But then I guess you can say GenG could've just picked it… -CT
So people said that Rakan is the reason they lost but, to be honest, it wasn't a pick that completely demolished their comp. It was doable. Other picks like Bard would've worked too.
GenG's Biggest Mistake
So for G2 Wunder, Caps, Mikyx all did a great job and their level 1/2 prep was great. But let's look at this from LCK's perspective. GenG's mid and jungle wasn't able be on form but form is form and that's always a thing you can control. But there was so many times where they got caught offguard by something they had info on. They saw them but didn't expect them to come in but G2 is the team that will go. -Pony
To be honest this series was uninteresting. GenG didn't bring anything new to pick/ban and they didn't do well with the old picks either. It really felt that they didn't do a good job preping.
TES vs Sunning Prediction
So I think TES will win because they are the favored one. I think TES have 70% against Sunning's 40% -CT
I think it will be closer more like TES 55% vs Sunning 45%. -Pony
G2 vs Damwon Prediction
So I am not being biased because I am from LCK but I truly think Damwon will win. Watching G2's games however worries me a bit so I will put Damwon 70% against G2's 30%. -CT
I think Damwon are 90%. Damwon are ultimate being. -Pony
So GenG gave Damwon a gift. Yes, they lost 0:3 but they gave many valuable information to Damwon. -CT
Like don't pick TF when they can pick Sylas -Pony
So disregarding the end result I think Jankos' form this series was a bit weird this game. -Pony
Yeah, I agree I don't think Jankos did well this series. -CT
This is something that will be interesting because Jankos was against Clid who was also out of form but now he has to face Canyon. If Jankos stays the same against Canyon then Caps have to do everything and to be honest Caps is already doing everything. This means Caps have do more than everything and Caps is a human so I am not sure if he can do it. -Pony
Wunder is also against Nurguri which is in a complete Excaliber with Rascal. Nuguri can play basically everything like even Ornn so their pick/ban will have much more freedom. -CT
But if Wunder was able to win then it would be probably because of his innovative picks. I think he still have picks hidden. Since he is from Europe the land of wacky innovations. -Pony
Damwon's bot lane isn't that exploitable either so I think overall Damwon has the advantage. -CT
And I think if they take away Jhin Perkz will be more vulnerable. -Pony
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