Stellaris

The power of the land armies in Stellaris.

stellaris 3 - The power of the land armies in Stellaris.
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The only official image of ground combat that I could find.


Counting the troops.

We know that the number of pops is related to the numbers of troops in one to one.

Each pop can supply the human capital necessary to one pop at the maximum mobilization.

The most modern instances of mass mobilization in war was during WW2.

During the war, the USA had 132 million citizen as it population, and at 1945, 8,267,958 soldiers were enlisted in the US army, or around 6% of the population to be put in the frontlines, but the total of personal put outside of the economy to work towards the war effort was 12,209,238, counting navy, marines, and coast guard, or 7.7% of the population.

The United Kingdom, that was involved in the war since its first year, had mobilized around 22% of its metropolitan population, to be put outside the economy and in direct war effort.

Soo, in a total war scenario, we could assume that at between 7.7% and 22% of the population of the UNE could be mobilized to war, if they just couldn't do better than we did back in WW2, and we probably could do better today, but let's remain in the realms of what we actually have proofs.

At the lowest end, that means UNE´s armies have 693 million soldiers as it limits in 01/01/2200 or 2.08 pops.

At the highest end, that means that the UNE´s armies have 1.98 Billion soldiers, or almost 6 pops outside the economy as it limit in 01/01/2200

A medium of 15% of the population would be more reasonable, (7,7%+22%=29,7% , 29,7%/2=14,8%) putting the number of soldiers in 1,35 Billion soldiers ready to defend the universal rights of all sentient life.

All those 1350 millions are spread amongst 35 units (33 assault armies and 2 defense armies from the enforcers) the defense armies are actually stronger than the game start assault armies with the same overall rank, or 1/8 stronger than the regular army in moral and military power, and that is why i´ll give them 1/8 more of manpower.

On average, we have 38,4 million soldiers per assaut army and 41,63 million soldiers per defence army.

That is just the manpower, and for equipment is more.

The transport ship actually uses alloys for its building, 40 alloys to be exact.

From 2 minerals we have 1 alloy, or the cost of the ship is around 80 minerals

That left the rest 20 minerals to supply the troops, or 113,4 Megatons of equipment for each transport ship

To put into perspective.

The entire USA modern army, navy, air force and nukes is around mass around 4,49 Megatons of equipment (Tanks, ACPs Ships, missiles, etc) or 79% of 1 mineral , with 1,3 million personnel to use this wargear.

The all the punic wars killed approximately 1,25–1,8 million soldiers in total.

The People's Liberation Army of China counts around 2,5 million soldiers counting the reserves in 2020.

The french army in WW1 had 4 million soldiers after the mobilization in 1914.

The Central powers manage to mobilize 25,2 million soldiers during WW1

The total URSS army during the ww2, (that means, including all the soldiers that had died) is around 38,7 million soldiers.

And the entire WW2 killed 85 million persons in total.

One assault army has 38,4 million soldiers, and they aren't cannon fodder, they are very well equipped with 113,4 megatons of war material and are coordinated enough to wage battle across an entire planet.

And even if the transport ship is cut off from the empire, they still can recover their fighting force,their armies seem to not suffer from the lack of food and supplies when fighting planet-side, imagine the logistics to keep such a large force engaged in combat fully fed and supplied even if they were losing badly.

Those armies can fight in dense jungle worlds, to the open fields of a continental world, in the torrencial seas of an ocean world to the dry wastelands of the desert worlds and from the radioactive hellhole of Tomb world, to the lush and diverse landscape of a Gaia World, all without any type of drawbacks.

Even if cut off from their interstellar supply lines, they can still recycle/manufacture their equipment and heal their soldiers to battle readiness in days.

And in stellaris, you can have up to 8 armies as your frontline in a world of the size of Earth, and up to 10 in a 25 size world.

That is about 307,2 to 384 million soldiers in your front line, imagine the entirety of the US´s population, every men, women, child and eldery in frontline duty, and you will understand what is what one planetary invasion in stellaris is in just in the amount of soldiers.

And this is just with regular old soldiers, we know that because combat exoskeletons is a technology to be researched.

But now, what about the other armies?

The slave army is the weakest in game stats, and they cost us only 50 minerals

The clone army is as strong as the regular army and it costs us 75 minerals.

Less than the 80 minerals needed to build the transport ship.

What does that revelate to us?

That the minerals are relative only to the army´s rasing and equipment.

That means, the regular assault army, don't have access to 113,4 megatons of equipment, but around half gigaton of war gear.

Those armies are very, very, very well equipped.

Another thing to consider: There are arguments to point that armies expend most of its war gear trying to train their soldiers, but we don´t drill armies with disposable aircraft carriers and let them blow up themselves in fake warzones, that is just wasteful, and even if they did just that, they still would have hundreds of megatons of equipment still intact.

Even if you would need mobile factories and to build/recycle everything that you army might need to wadge war planet-side, the army would have more than enough to maintain their war for years.

Gene Warriors are also limited by population, their description says that they are usually taken from the elite of their military forces, but, as the assault army, the gene warriors also have a 1/1 ratio from the population at maximum numbers.

That means that the gene warrior army have exactly the same numbers as an assault army, 38,4 million Gene Warriors per army

And a gene soldier is 100% more efficient in what he does than a regular assault troop, as it does 100% more damage to the enemy than its counterpart, and considering the health, it can take 140% more punishment than the regular warrior, I say more efficient because is plausible that a gene warrior is at the peak of human physical capabilities.

But that isn't the strongest biological soldiers that the UNE could produce.

The theoretical maximum force of a Gene Warrior army, lets call them Alpha gene warriors (Robust,Erudite,Very Strong,Resilient and Repugnant/or/Robust Erudite Very Strong and Wasteful.), with all the traits optimized to it, is around 5.40 – 10.80 , or 360% more efficient than the regular soldier.

Fun fact: the human body actually uses only 1/3 of its total force in normal situations, but when there is enough adrenaline in your body (normally to life or death situations) you can actually use the total force of your body.

The actual record for a baseline human from deadlift is 501 Kg.

If this person was in a life or death situation, the maximum force it could deadlift around 1503 kg.

If we say that a baseline gene warrior is at least at peak human conditions (it probably would be more), and the genetic therapy allowed him to access up to 2/3 of his force in regular situations, that means a regular gene warrior, without an exoskeleton or other equipment, would be able to deadlift around 1000 Kg

A little note here: Efficiency doesn't mean exactly brute force, but if a regular soldier would gain 2x his force, he could carry more ammo, more protection, or just be far faster than a regular soldier could, and thus, his efficiency in battle would increase, but increasing his reflexes, eyesight, hearing, etc also could increase his efficiency, but because we know that the procedure to turn a regular person into a gene warrior requires an extensive gene therapy, and going with the trope of regular super soldiers, the improvements would increase every factor by the rate of efficiency.

And thus, the Alpha Gene Warrior, would be able to deadlift around 3.6 tons off the ground with similar limitations, those guys could throw a Toyota Corolla 2015 at you with relative ease, and about his speed, he is as fast as strength allows.

The highest theoretically possible that a baseline human can run is 60km/h, (using the 3/3 of his force) but the actual highest sprinting speed of a living human is around 45 Km/h (27,9 Mi/H), a Gene Warrior would be able to sprint at 89 km/h (55 Mi/h) (remember that sprinting speed is determined by strength and a gene warrior is able to use 2/3 of the total human force) and a Alpha Gene Warrior, would sprint around 160 Km/H (99 Mi/H) and about resistance, the fastest time that a baseline human could run a marathon (42,2 Km) was around 1 hour and 59 minutes and 40 seconds (2 hours) A Gene warrior would be able to run at least 84,1 Km in distance at the same time and a Alpha Gene Warrior, would be able to run 151 km at the same time, this is around the distance from the City of Luxembourg to Reims, France. Or From the Central Park in Manhattan, to Subaru Park in Philadelphia

Using the deadlifting strength, we could find out the maximum pushing and carrying strength.

CS=DS/2 PS=DSx2

The regular Gene Warrior could carry ups to 500 Kg and push ups to 2 tons

The Alpha Gene Warrior could carry ups to 1800 Kg and push ups to 7,2 tons away.

Remember, those are feats without any lifting equipment like exoskeletons and stuff.

Both of those guys could fight with 300 kg of armor and carrying another 100 kg of equipment without problem, heck, the Alpha gene warrior could be jumping several meters into the air with such equipment.

They are stronger in muscular power, but what about brain power?

We know that between 50 to 80% of our total intelligence is hereditary and transmitted by genetics, the rest 20%-50% is actually built up by intellectual development.

As far as I know, the closest thing we have to measure the intelligence of someone is IQ tests, soo, i´m going to use them to quantify the intelligence of such super soldiers.

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The highest IQs possible is theoretically 200, but yet, we manage to find people with up to 260 IQ today, that is because the average IQ tests are better in measuring the intelligence of the average people (90-110), and counting that in 2200 we didn't see nobody with a IQ higher than that.

Soo, at 50% of genetic determinism (GD), the average IQ of a gene warrior is 100-130 + his personal development

At 80% GD, is 160 to 208 points+ his personal development.

The average person has between 85-115 IQ, if we are using 50% of genetic determinism, that is around 42,5-57,5 points of IQ from genetics and 42,5-57,5 to personal development.

And at 80% of genetic determinism, is around 68-92 points of IQ, leaving 17-23 points for personal development.

Average IQ of a Gene Warrior at 50% GD= 142-157 (max IQ 200) or 172- 187 (Max IQ 260)

Average IQ of a Gene Warrior at 80% GD= 177- 183 (max IQ 200) or 225 – 231 (Max IQ 260)

At the lowest to highest, the IQ of an average gene warrior is around 142-231 of average intelligence.

To put into perspective: is estimated that Jorge Washinton had around 140 IQ, Elon Musk at 165 IQ, Einstein around 175 IQ

And the Alpha Gene Warriors would have 369-600 IQ

The fastest conscious human reaction is around 0,15 seconds, and unconscious actions can go up to 0,08 seconds, your reaction time is limited by how fast your brain can process what is happening, and this is limited by how quick your sinapsis are actually running inside your body, this is something also limited by genetics, we already found out ways to create more resistant neurons that can endure to run synapses to run 100 times faster than the regular human cells are capable of enduring, and the gene warriors having a reaction time of 10 to 36 times faster than the maximum human isn´t a far cry.

Gene Warrior: 0,015 seconds of conscious reaction to 0,008 seconds of unconscious reactions.

Alpha Gene Warrior: 0,0057 seconds of conscious reaction and 0,003 seconds for unconscious reactions.

To put into perspective how fast it is, an M16A1 shoots bullets at 975m/s

If a soldier shoots a Gene warrior at 50 meters, he would be fast enough to see the shot and actually dodge the bullet, a Alpha gene warrior could do it at relative ease at 10 meters.

How much such warriors would need to eat, and how often those need to sleep, and how fast they can regenerate wounds, I don't find any way to quantify.

A single average Gene Warrior, is a tactical genius, can crush skulls with his hands, doge bullets and sprint fast enough to outrun cars, and could walk dozens of km every day for weeks at end. And probably would be more than a match to 10-men strong SWAT squad in combat.

An average Alpha Gene Warrior, also naked, would probably bucher his way through several platoons of Navy Seals, he is way more mobile, faster, more lethal and is probably by far the smartest person that ever lived if one would be transported to Earth.

But neither a Gene Warrior or an Alpha Gene Warrior would be transported alone into Earth as an invasion force, they would be deployed into the 10s of millions, with 1,7 gigatons of military infrastructure and equipment to back them up.

Psi commandos also are built at the same unit limits as all the other armies, and by damage, they are also powerhouses, capable of doing 3-6 damage , two times more effective than the regular humans, but they do also half of collateral damage.

Their speciality are Terror Tactics, using the Shroud to demoralize the enemy army, and probably does most of its fighting as mental attacks and probably could control the weak minded elements of the enemy's armies, we know that because the technology that unlocks the armies are the Telepathy Tech.

And we know that they can also have precognition, how precise and useful, we don´t know, but only the tech description says that they can only conceive the thoughts before the target actually understand what their synapses actually are, this is around 2-5 seconds into the future, not much, but in a battlefield this is an eternity.

This time would shrink against enemies that can think faster than a regular human, against gene warriors, it would be around 0,2-0,5 seconds and against robots, even if they could be predicted, they couldn't read the 1s and 0s at an useful time frame.

Now let see the true walls of guns, the Slave, Clones and Xenomorph armies.

As all other armies, the slaves are limited by the amount of how many pops of that species, but theoretically, they could be more effective than normal assault armies.

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The technology that allowed slave armies are the Neural Implants, basically, the slaves think that their actions come from free will, but actually they aren't, that is the interpretation we could have from the tech description, we know that this is far from 100% effective because slave armies have lower moral than the regular assault armies, but is possible that they could actually coordinate better than the more normal armies because of direct link to his subjects brains.

In relation of equipment and training, they have less training than regular armies and half of their wargear, that still means 283,5 Megatons of equipment, they still can do as much damage as a regular army, with only their moral damage being actually lower, that indicates that training is much more advanced than we have today, probably with direct memory implantation and some kind of anabolic drugs that put you into fighting shape in months.

The clone armies are just better than the regular army in every way, costing 75 minerals, can be raised in a single month to fighting force, are as competent as normal armies and isn´t limited by the population of your species.

Because of that, the size of one clone army can be anything from 38,4 Million to a billion soldiers in one clone army, but because we know that a clone army occupy the same size in the planetary combat width than the normal armies, and because they are still the same species, is safe to say that those armies are the same size in quantity of soldiers, and thus 38,4 million soldiers.

The Xenomorph is hard to know , see, they are described as literally little more than claws, mouths and teeth, but actually they are more cunning than just that.

See, to unlock the Xenomorphs two technologies are to be researched first, Epigenetic Triggers: Basically, the ability to turn very smart creatures into fully sentient creatures.

And Morphogenetic Field Mastery, basically, allows a biological creature to be controlled by others from pure biological ways without the limitation of the creatures needing to be of the same species, that is the interpretation that came with the tech description.

Some degree of this tech is probably what allowed the hiveminds to be a thing in stellaris, and we know that they are related because a hivemind has a 1,25x positive modifier to this tech be available to research.

Soo, a Xenomorph army is akin to several hiveminds of very intelligent/sentient beasts that are guided by scientist and supervisors to rip and tear their way into the enemy lines, and is possible that they are also using equipment or some kind of bio weaponry, and nothing really say that those things need to be the same size, they could be fly sized creatures that swarm the enemy in their trillions, hundreds of millions bulk monstrosities that rush into to the enemy lines , building size behemoths that are basically living tanks, or more plausibly, all of the above and more, soo numbers of troops are not really meaning anything, what does have meaning are their total biomass.

The average soldier is 72,5 kg in weight, in each army, we have 38,4 million or 3,84×10^7 soldiers.

That is around 2,7 Megatons in biomass, and that is probably the level of mass that our lovely hordes of tentacle monsters would have access this without counting their arsenal as biomass, because if we did considered all of their weapons that they could bring are the meat cannons, bone rifles etc etc, this would be around 1,13 gigatons of biomass, and the equipment needed to control such creatures are soo much lower than this that is effectively irrelevant.

To put into perspective how much biomass this would be, the entire animal population of our world, this including aquatic animals as well, is around 2 gigatons of biomass, two armies would have more biomass than the entirety fauna of morden Earth, and if those creatures would be attacking Earth, we are speaking of 9 gigatons of biomass rampaging across the globe.

Now, lets see the big guys.

We still have Titanic armies , the Azizians and the Titanic lifeforms.

We can say that both are related, as both actually have the same army stats, expet, that the Azizians actually do only 100% of Devastation while the titanic lifeforms do 300%.

Both are known to have only basic levels of sentience, and thus, the difference isn´t how smart each individual titanic soldier is, but maybe, how big they are.

We know that the Azizians have 20 tons in weight, that is the double of the heaviest land animal alive, the African Elephant, massing around 4.9 tons, by the square cube law, the azizians are around 40-50% larger than those animals, around 5,46 meters, we know that they much larger than that because of their slug like anatomy, and slugs are generally 10-20 cm long and 0,5 cm tall, propotionaly, this is a creature of 100 to 218 meters long.

That is a train-size mudder slug coming right at you.

How many of them are actually in a army, I didn't find anyway to actually quantify, because we know that those lovely creatures can do more damage than an army of an Alpha Gene Warriors (5.40 – 10.80) with the same empire wide bonus, at 6.3 – 12.6 damage to the enemy (4.50 – 9.00 base), my estimative is between 15 to 30 million slugs in one army, considering their limited intelligence.

And the titanic life forms

Contrary of the train size slugs, the titanic life forms are not a single species, and because only some the more humanoid creatures (most of the sentient life in stellaris fit in the classical definition of humanoid, 2 arms, 2 legs, one head, walking upright etc etc), or at least those with free arms, would be used as soldiers, and because we know that some actually want to be enlisted into the military by the event, we know that they have some degree of sentience.

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There are two ways we could go about to find out the size of those creatures.

1- Calculating based on the size of the slugs

2- Calculating based on the mass of the slugs.

So, those creatures caused 3x the devastation of the slugs, we know that devastation isn't something intentional, as we know that elite troops with high morale (Gene Warriors and Psi commandos) actually do less devastation, and thus the devastation can be caused by their size, discipline or their mass.

They actually have higher morals than the Gene Warriors, and thus, their discipline isn't the cause.

3x the mass, that would put our titan troopers around 90 tons.

By the square cube law, such a creature would be 10-11x larger than your average person, or around 17 meters tall , this is around 3 times the average size of an girafe, but not even near the size that they are described, he would be 10 meters taller than a Spinosaurus.

If we are going by size, we arrive at similar conclusions, with those titan troopers being around 16,3 meters tall.

And because we know that those creatures are actually more likely to spawn in a world with heavier gravity than normal, with an 8x modifier if the world has High Gravity and thus, is safe to say that their force escalates more than proportionally with their size without all the problems of being this tall.

An average human of 75 kg can deadlift around 61 kg without training and up to 180 with average training.

Scaling that to the level of those creatures, that means the dead lift capacity of those creatures would be around 73.2 Tons to 216 Tons.

Using our caring and pushing formula, we arrive at a conclusion that those guys can carry around 36-108 tons and pushing aside 146,4 – 432 Tons.

And those guys are demolishing the enemy at 4.50 – 9.00 damage at base.

About the numbers per army, considering they are three times more massive and stronger than the average slug, they probably are few in number, probably around 5-15 millions per army.

Now i´m going to take numbers for another canon empire, the Earth Custodianship, just to explore some possibilities before coming back to our lovely UNE.

The Hunter-killer armies still are at the same proportions and numbers of a standard army and strangely, they are limited by the robotic population, the most rational explanation is that they are actually refitting the common units into the hunter killers or just recycling them into those hunter killer drones, but even them, this limitation about the robots can be seen as just a gameplay constraint.

Battle Frame armies are described as large and bipedal robots that have a more organic tactical mind, faster and more agile than they should look and thus, are able to improvise and are able to pull off some incredible tactics in war.

Hitting the enemy at 3.16 -6.3 damage and 2.25 – 4.50 at base, those creatures are also limited by the amount of mechanical pops, and thus, are safe to say that they are at the same numbers as a regular biological army.

And the stars of the day, the absolute units, the weapons of true devastations, the Mega-Warforms.

Those bad boys are stated to be one single unit per army, having the firepower in excess of most armies and they aren´t limited by the population of robots.

This thing would weigh around 4,5 gigatons and still is able to walk amongst a battlefield, how fast those things would be, is hard to tell, but because they are able to fight around the globe, those things are considerably quicker than we could expect.

The closest thing I could think that we have weight to compare are Warlord Titans (40k) at the , those warlord titans mass up to 2,5 megatons, the Mega-Warform is around 1.800 times more massive than that, and by the square cube law, 12,1 times larger.

That doesn't mean much in terms of actual numbers, because 40k titans are as large as plot demands, but the most solid numbers that I could find to use tells that the warlords are as tall as 200 meters.

That puts our Mega Warforms at 2,4 km tall, but still is smaller than Metroplex (transformers) From the Fall of Cybertron that is 9,7 km tall.

To put into perspective, if someone put one of those on Earth, it instantly became the 11th tallest mountain in the world.

About the fire power, the only thing we have to make any type of estimative are their mass, and this thing is more than half the mass of a Game-Start Corvette, and probably have a equal if not more firepower than a corvette, because the tech cost (5000) is lower than tier V Lasers (4000).

Soo this thing would have at bare minimum have 174 Petatons TNT in firepower (considering half of the firepower of a gaming start corvette) you could actually drop 8 of those things in a Earth-Size planets, and this would be around 1,392 exotons of firepower being unleash, this is more than enough energy to glass a planet of this size in scenario without any gameplay constraint.

But, with gameplay constraints, a Mega Warform can endure at maximum 100-200 shots from itself.

If we translate this to an scenario without gameplay constraints, this warforms could resist 17,4-34,8 Exatons of force, it is actually more resistant than a corvette, and considering the tech diferente and evolution to reach the point to actually build such thing, and because we don´t know how much of those would be absorbed by hull, armor and shields of the thing.

Also in a scenario without gameplay constraints, if you cracked the world, and the Mega Warforms aren't actually being hit directly by the laser, they might actually survive planetary destruction , given how resilient such things are.

Remember, all those robots are actually self sufficient in terms of energy, even if they cost energy credits, if you are at negative -1K of energy, they simply don't have a single debuff.

Now, let's go back to the UNE because their scientists made an archaeological breakthrough and they found the Cybrex Alpha and found a Cybrex war forge.

The Cybrex warform is also one gigant mega robot

The price to have one of those are in alloys instead of minerals, this unit cost the same as 2,5 game-start corvettes massing 20,5 Gigatons of Devastation.

This monster would be around 18 km tall and could bring to bare it´s full fire power, without any gameplay constraint, it could bring the fire power of 2,5 game-start corvettes, or around 870 petatons of TNT, with gameplay constraints, it is 1,25x more powerful than the Mega Warform.

In total, this warform brings us 10.5 – 21 Army strength with all the non empire-specific gameplay bonus and around 7.50 – 15.00 at base value.

It could survive 93-186 shots from itself.

But, it isn´t the most powerful unit, that is, there are creatures that dwell in the realms of The Shroud and in the right situations can be summoned to fight.

This creature is described as a titanic warrior and we know that the arcane powers of this creature can give the enemy army around 7.50 – 15.00 damage and with the empire wild bonus, 10.5-21.

It could survive 93-186 attacks from itself as well.

Still, once an entire civilization coalesced into a single individual, a single unit of unparalleled power, it could range from massive battleships, a warform-size killing machine to a person-size robot.

His name is Gray, and his Omnicombat form BOLO-5 is demolishing the enemy at 15.00 – 30.00 units of power at base, and 21-42 at the highest end.

Gray could survive 240-120 attacks from itself.


Possible UNE armies stats:

Defense armies: 41,63 million soldiers per defence army, equipped by unknown, possibly 612 megatons of wargear, max defined by buildings.

Assault armies: 38,4 million per army equipped with 567 megatons of wargear, with 15% mobilization limit, 1,35 billion soldiers

Clone armies: 38,4 million per army equipped with 425,2 megatons of wargear, no limits of building.

Advanced armies (probable to gain access to one or three eventually)

Gene Warriors (including the Alpha Gene Warrior): 38,4 million per army, armed with 1,7 gigatons of cutting edge wargear, at 1,35 billion soldiers at 15% mobilization.

Psi Commandos: 38,4 million per army, equipped with 1,417 Gigatons of wargear.

Xenomorth hordes: 1,13 gigatons of biomass of teeth, jaws claws, limited only by how much biomass you can molde into the stuff of nightmare.

Robotic Assault Armies: 38,4 millions per army, fearless, and it is equipped with 567 megatons of wargear, probably profited from the local robotic units, and thus, limited by population.

Unique armies (Less likely to have)

Azizians Death Slugs: estimated of 15-30 millions per army, armed by 1,4 gigatons of equipment, limited to three armies.

Psi Avatar: Absolute unit, gifted by the power of the gods.

Cybrex Warform: A single warmachine possibly bipedal weighing 20,5 Gigatons, clad and equipped by 250 units of Alloys, and the only limit of units you can have are how much your economy can sustain.

Gray: Will be by your side for the next 5000 years, immortal governor, ultra powerful warship (even if it isn't very high tech) and also can be transformed into a War form that can bring down a Cybrex Warform with ease in a 1 vs 1.

Source: Original link


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